Re: [boost] Customer Friendlier Boost Installation

From: Manfred Doudar (manfred.doudar_at_[hidden])
Date: 2005-05-26 03:50:54

David Abrahams wrote:

>"David Bergman" <davidb_at_[hidden]> writes:
>
>>David Abrahams wrote: 
>>
>>>Oliver Kullmann <O.Kullmann_at_[hidden]> writes:
>>>
>>>
[snip...]

>>>>The exciting thing about Boost is that it is Avantgarde, a 
>>>>
>>>>good deal of interesting research(!), and not compromising on 
>>>>
>>>>quality. That's at least my understanding of Boost.
>>>>

Boost only is so by the extent of its reach/familarity - ie it really is
a matter of exposure; any other consideration of Boost is really a matter
perception.

What is exciting about Boost is the exploration into new avenues - the
overwhelming desire to do better, and chart unexplored teritory;
the MPL, Fusion or the Boost.PP are such examples; and then there is the
level of quality output and constant peer review - discussions beyond
the text book.  -That's what makes Boost exciting.

>>>We don't want to be Avantgarde/research; to the extent that 
>>>we are, we need to fix it.
>>>
>>I agree with that, unless one replaces the "Avantgarde/research" with "for
>>experts." I.e., I want Boost to remain a choice for C++ experts.
>>
>

I believe the waters have become muddied here - I'm going to go out on
a limb here and hazard a guess that the intended statement was that we
don't want to compramise on the quality of Boost - and I don't think
that will ever happen.

To an extent, the Boost community is a collective for the advancement
of the language (whence research), and a worthy advocate and signpost
to the rest of the world to advertise the worth of the language - our
signposts just need to be bigger - otherwise Boost withers.

>We never wanted to be the sole province of experts.  We always wanted
>widespread usage.  If you want to be a member of an exclusive
>"experts" club this is the wrong place to find it.
>

Agreed.  If Boost were ever to be the province of experts it would defeat
its very purpose - namely to grow and flourish throughout the C++ community;
to be an example and a leader in modern C++ method, design, and direction.

> [snip...]
>
>>What I am saying is that it would not be unreasonable to expect the
>>targeted developers to actually type 'bjam', and perhaps even set
>>the proper environment variables.
>>
>
>It would be unreasonable for some of them.  I've worked with quite
>advanced and competent developers who are only comfortable in an IDE.
>

I sympathize.  I only work on the command line (Unix / Linux).  I could
never work with an IDE, and if I had too I'd be lost - so in the same
vein, I am sure those not comfortable with command line tools are just as
lost as I, when set in front of an IDE.  -Boost needs to better cater for
their needs, it's a sad reality, but too many coders out there don't live
on the command line.

>>I do not think we have to flirt with the masses
>>
>
>Too late ;-)
>

Indeed ;-)
And again I stress, if we don't Boost dies - and none of us wants that.

>> - developers that would not use the facilities found in Boost
>>anyway - in order to position it better for incorporation into
>>future C++ standardizations.
>>
>
>Yes, we do.  We need maximal adoption in order to be best positioned
>for standardization.  Not just to get the libraries accepted, but also
>so they are really deserving of standardization.
>

Again, well said.

my $0.02

Cheers,
-- 
Manfred Doudar
MetOcean Engineers
www.metoceanengineers.com